Megan the Phantom Girlie
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Mark's religionOne is able to gather that Mark is Jewish from several dropped comments in the script. However, his mother calls on Christmas Eve to tell him that his family will miss him tomorrow. Do you suppose the Cohen family celebrates Christmas and Hannukah, or that Hanukkah started on December 25 (like it did last year)? It's not really important- I smelled a plot hole, that's all.
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DramaRobin2002
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I always thought that Mark's family just celebrated both holidays. Maybe he's even half and half- father's Jewish, mother's Christian.
~~~Amy~~~
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MzGalinda
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Yeah, but there was also that line from La Vie Boheme that dealt with the High Holy Days, which is a Jewish custom...
You make the call.
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DramaRobin2002
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| MzGalinda wrote: | Yeah, but there was also that line from La Vie Boheme that dealt with the High Holy Days, which is a Jewish custom...
You make the call. |
Well, even if Mark was only half Jewish or was one of the Jewish families that celebrates Christmas and Hannukah, I think he would still celebrate other Jewish customs. There's no way he is not Jewish at all.
~~~Amy~~~
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EponineGiry
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Many Jewish families, whether or not it's Hanukah or if they celebrate Christmas, just like to get together on Christmas, because it's a federal holiday (yay for the separation of church and state!) so most don't have work.
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MzGalinda
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Oh no, there's not doubt about it that he definitely IS Jewish. We're just judging on whether he's 100% or not.
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RyanJ
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Mark is a buddhist.
yep.
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what_the_heck013
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Mark is Jewish. End of subject.
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DramaRobin2002
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| RyanJ wrote: | Mark is a buddhist.
yep. |
Really? I thought he was Wiccan. Hmm, interesting...
~~~Amy~~~
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pete1974
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No Maureen is the wiccan YUK YUK YUK!!!!
sorry, couldn't resist 
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RyanJ
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ok seriously, I think that Mark comes from two parents who are christian and jewish. Mark himself I think is more christian only because there isn't really any mention of him celebrating or even acknowledging hanukkah. He is living with people who are celebrating christmas though, and even though that doesn't make Mark any religion, it would make sense if he was christian as well.
But the whole line about his inability to hold an erection on High Holy Days is kind of confusing, does that make him jewish? Or is it just like a little random fact thrown in there?
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kiya18
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| pete1974 wrote: | Really? I thought he was Wiccan. Hmm, interesting...
~~~Amy~~~ |
No Maureen is the wiccan HAR HAR HAR!!!!
sorry, couldn't resist [/quote]
*throws something*  That was so terrible and yet it totally made my day.
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FreddiesHalfMic
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I think he's completely Jewish. Christmas has become very secular and many people celebrate it just for the hell of it, without attention to the religious aspects, so that's my 2 cents. Could be wrong, though.
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pete1974
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| FreddiesHalfMic wrote: | | I think he's completely Jewish. Christmas has become very secular and many people celebrate it just for the hell of it, without attention to the religious aspects, so that's my 2 cents. Could be wrong, though. |
Actually in all honesty, I know several Jewish folks who celebrate both Christmas and Hanukkah and just do the secular part of Christmas.
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what_the_heck013
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I celebrate both Christmas and Chanukah.
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DramaRobin2002
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| pete1974 wrote: | No Maureen is the wiccan YUK YUK YUK!!!!
sorry, couldn't resist |
I second that and raise you a  . That did make me laugh a bit more than it should have.
~~~Amy~~~
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cabaretfreak
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I think Mark is Jewish because if you listen closely to the begging of "La Vie Behome" you can hear him saying "Oh vey"
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DramaRobin2002
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| cabaretfreak wrote: | | I think Mark is Jewish because if you listen closely to the begging of "La Vie Behome" you can hear him saying "Oh vey" |
If that's the part I'm think of, the waiter actually says, "Oy vey". It's in reference to the rowdy group coming into the Life and Maureen going over to the " important customers' " (a.k.a. Benny's and Mr. Grey's) table.
~~~Amy~~~
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RyanJ
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I thought the waiter from the Life Cafe said "oy vey"? Or maybe a random customer?
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EponineGiry
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It's the waiter, if we're all thinking of the same part, namely:
MAUREEN: We'll stay.
WAITER: Oy vey.
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cabaretfreak
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I just listened to part. I think it is mostly a toss-up. It sort of sounds like both characters.
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DramaRobin2002
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It does kinda sound like Mark, but it's definitely the waiter according to both the Rent Bible and the lyrics inside the OBC book.
~~~Amy~~~
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NoOneMournsTheWicked
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I'm Jewish and not only do I, but a lot of other Jewish people I know celebrate 'American Christmas'. You get presents and stuff on X-mas and you have a tree, just so you don't feel left out.
This grew out of the fact that I live in an extremely Italian Catholic neighborhood, and my mom didn't want me and my brothers to feel like outsiders.
So maybe Mark has an 'American Christmas'.
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musicallover
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Ah, the question of all time pops up again. I always thought that Mark's family celebrated both holidays; Hanukah and Christmas. I know a Jewish family who does that. Although, I think Tevye would roll over in his grave at the thought.
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qpidsangel
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i think his mom is jewish and his dad is christian or whatever. "Even your father says mozeltuff" (Sry i don't know how to spell it)
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briggsgirl
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mazel tov
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EponineGiry
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| qpidsangel wrote: | | i think his mom is jewish and his dad is christian or whatever. "Even your father says mozeltuff" (Sry i don't know how to spell it) |
Another interpretation could be that Mark and his father don't get along (especially because Mrs. Cohen implores her son to call him).
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theatrefanatic
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in Johnathon Larsons notes that u see in the documentary on the dvd it says he comes from middle class jews in queens
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Mimi Marquez
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Mark is DEFINITELY WITHOUT A DOUBT Jewish. Take it from a fellow jew, I can spot them from a mile away! Haha... okay and end racist jokes.
But seriously. There are so many jokes about it and also his name is Mark COHEN... it doesn't get any more jewish than that.
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broadwaybaby246
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seth cohen from the OC is jewish and christian and celebrated "chrismukkah" maybe Mark does too 
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mystic aura1899
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I celebrate both Christmas ands Hanukah. Maybe Mark's a cashew, like me.
Cashew = half catholic, half-jewish. Say it out loud and sound it out.
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Bway_Shi
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I think he Celebrates Christmas and Hanukah, he mentions Jewish Holidays many times yet sings "O little town of Bethlehem" and his family does call him on Christmas Eve...
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norayouadora
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Isn't it, in Judaism, that the mother's religion decides the religion of the children? So Mark's mom is probably Jewish, at the least. I think EponineGiry be right that when she says, "even your father says mazel tov," that might mean that Mark and his dad don't have a good relationship. But it could also refer to a lot of things, like he's saying it despite his disapproval of Mark's career, or he's saying it despite the fact that he's not Jewish (pure speculation here). But I think he's totally Jewish--there are many so many places in the show where they refer to it, such as learning to dance with the rabbi's daughter at the Scarsdale Jewish Community Center, "high holy days," his mom saying mazel tov, etc. These are pretty specific, whereas all of the christian-ish references are to the commercial parts of it, such as carols (which any Jewish kid can recognize, especially by Mark's age), trees, etc. Maybe in the year that the play is taking place, Hannukah and Christmas overlap. Or his family is throwing an annual holiday party or something, and that's while they'll "miss him." Orrr maybe it is just a plot hole! Hehe, jk.
Anyways, there are tons of ways to prove/disprove this, so I dunno. But even if he IS half-and-half, I prefer to think of him as a nice Jewish boy.  Lol.
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DaddyDiesel
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To be honest. I'm thinking that We could never tell what Marks religion is. Mainly because we know his parents are religous in someway. Im guessing since his father says "mazeltuff" he is the Jewish one. Mark might have been brought up jewish he could be somthing else. It is very possible that the childs religion can be differant then the parents. Its mostly charactors around him that mention the religion question around him. Now the movie could be differant because HE mentions his barmitsfah.
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musicallover09
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| Quote: | | But I think he's totally Jewish--there are many so many places in the show where they refer to it, such as learning to dance with the rabbi's daughter at the Scarsdale Jewish Community Center |
the scarsdale jewish community center isnt mentioned in the show... atleast not on the cd...
this is just me thinking here but i thought when they say "high holy days" they just mean like when hes actually gonna score... but i never knew it had jewish ties also... so that changes the whole thing i guess... lol
Bret
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DramaRobin2002
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| musicallover09 wrote: | | Quote: | | But I think he's totally Jewish--there are many so many places in the show where they refer to it, such as learning to dance with the rabbi's daughter at the Scarsdale Jewish Community Center |
the scarsdale jewish community center isnt mentioned in the show... atleast not on the cd...
this is just me thinking here but i thought when they say "high holy days" they just mean like when hes actually gonna score... but i never knew it had jewish ties also... so that changes the whole thing i guess... lol
Bret |
It is in the show. It's just not on the OBCR.
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musicallover09
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| Quote: | | It is in the show. It's just not on the OBCR. |
thanks for correcting me... i wish i could see this show... SO MUCH its not even funny... i wish i tour would come around soon... 
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DramaRobin2002
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| musicallover09 wrote: | | Quote: | | It is in the show. It's just not on the OBCR. |
thanks for correcting me... i wish i could see this show... SO MUCH its not even funny... i wish i tour would come around soon... |
No problem. There is a national tour running, maybe it will head near your area.
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musicallover09
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| Quote: | maybe it will head near your area.
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the only pro theater clevland (ohio) but im happy i get to go see wicked soon!!! yay... i hope we get tix...
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ShadowInTheWings
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Anyone know if the National Tour is going to hit Seattle amy time soon?
RENT was profoundly unpopular both times it came here (Vancouver, BC), so Seattle is my best shot at seeing it in the near future.
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wishiwuzfamous
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I don't know if he's fully Jewish or not, but he IS Jewish. In Tango Maureen when JoAnn asks him where he learned to tango, he said something about "Nanette (something or other), the rabbi's daughter, at the (someplace) Jewish Community Center." He's Jewish.
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Gazelle
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Not to sound KIA or to come on strong, but if you have Cathlic/Christian and Jewish parents, that doesn't make you both. if you believe it does...then you are a 'Jew For Jesus' 
This is what i've analized it down to:
Mark's mother is Jewish. His father is not. That's why it was such a big deal for his mother to tell Mark that 'even your father says mazel tov!'
After your 15 years of burning in religious school ( ! ) many people i know completely stop practicing.
i think that once Mark was out of the hou-
OH! oh oh oh! i JUST got it! Maureen's the wiccan! witch! Menzel as Elphaba! Wow... this has been a slooow day. haha very good Gaz 
i think that once Mark was out of the house he really didn't care anymore he was just happy to be out. And when did they actully 'celebrate' xmas? Did they all go to church, go home to families, exchange gifts? Just like Angel said 'some people have no where else to go' impling that they didn't have anything better to do on christmas eve.
my 2c 
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DramaRobin2002
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| Gazelle wrote: | Not to sound KIA or to come on strong, but if you have Cathlic/Christian and Jewish parents, that doesn't make you both. if you believe it does...then you are a 'Jew For Jesus'
This is what i've analized it down to:
Mark's mother is Jewish. His father is not. That's why it was such a big deal for his mother to tell Mark that 'even your father says mazel tov!'
After your 15 years of burning in religious school ( ! ) many people i know completely stop practicing.
i think that once Mark was out of the hou-
OH! oh oh oh! i JUST got it! Maureen's the wiccan! witch! Menzel as Elphaba! Wow... this has been a slooow day. haha very good Gaz
i think that once Mark was out of the house he really didn't care anymore he was just happy to be out. And when did they actully 'celebrate' xmas? Did they all go to church, go home to families, exchange gifts? Just like Angel said 'some people have no where else to go' impling that they didn't have anything better to do on christmas eve.
my 2c |
It might not make you both, but many children who have a Catholic parent and a Jewish parent do celebrate both sets of religious days. The Bohemians didn't celebrate Christmas and I don't think anyone suggested they did. This thread was mainly focused on Mark's family. Mark's mom does say, "And we'll miss you tomorrow." Meaning that Mark's family is getting together on Christmas Day. I tend to think that both of Mark's parents are Jewish and they just recognize the day of Christmas as a secular holiday to gather the family.
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Gazelle
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Yes, i agree that they can celebrate both, as i have (raised jewish living with a non-jewish father w. cathalic family) i just didn't see the point in adding that since everyone else had talked about it. *shrug*
The main reason why i think that his parents practice differently is...actully just because of that one line-
"  even your father says mazel tov!"
To me that meant what i said before...or it could also easily mean that Mark and his father aren't close and don't talk often.
...of course...i just relized on comparasion of Mark's father spoken of on stage, i think of him completely different when recalling the movie... hmmm
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norayouadora
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| Gazelle wrote: | | To me that meant what i said before...or it could also easily mean that Mark and his father aren't close and don't talk often. |
Yeah, I always thought it meant something like that. In fact, it never really occurred to me before reading this thread that it could mean anything else. But I suppose when you think about it, both explanations are plausible. I guess it just depends on which one you prefer... I prefer that one. Obviously.
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MsDivaKate
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| norayouadora wrote: | | Isn't it, in Judaism, that the mother's religion decides the religion of the children? So Mark's mom is probably Jewish, at the least. |
In a lot of religions the mother's religion is supposed to be the child's religion. My friend's mother is Catholic, her father is Jewish. All of the children were raised Jewish. They still celebrate some of the christian holidays for the mother's sake, but focus mainly on the religious ones. My father converted, so I didn't have to play around with any of that lol
Be that it may, I feel that Mark is probably completely Jewish. Or at least that his father is definitely the one who is Jewish, not to stereotype or anything, but Cohen is a common Jewish last name, which would make his father Jewish, assuming that he and his father have the same last name. (and why wouldn't we make this assumption.)
As for the "even your father says mazeltov" I think that just symbolizes that there is a rift in the father-son relationship, especially since its followed with Mark's mother urging "honey...call him!"
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