[postmodern-mango-salsa]

If you're a fangirl, please step aside, you'll make it worse.

Everyone I LOVES Wicked with a hot fiery passion. Me? Not so much. I find the music... blah. It's too RANDOM as far as notes go, I can't follow the melodies, and sometimes it just drowns me in *YUK*

SO

What I'm asking, is SOMEONE PLEASE give me a reason to like it.
Seriously, I honestly WANT to like it.

So reason away
hopefully I'll like it with time ><

[pish123c]

Debates on whether Wicked is good or bad have all been done before multiple times. Just check this forum and you're bound to find a few.


Next.

[Mistress]

It's alright, hon. You don't have to like it, there are plenty of folks here who don't, and with good reason. The plot is saccerhine and slightly shallow, although the character of Elphaba helps fix that to some degree as she is still the most complex of the characters, where as the rest have been simplified to dodos, like Fiyero. He was much more complex in the novel, now he's just the stock love interest, nothing more. All that being said, I still love the show, and the book. Honestly, just because the show has mass appeal, it doesn't mean you must like it . I'd still reccommend the novel though. It's a great read once you get past the rather plentiful sex scenes.

[mastachen]

a) I thought Nessarose and the Wizard were fairly deep characters though, Elphaba not as much. However, neither were given enough materials to properly develop the character


b) Is it wrong that I found it a great read because of the sex scenes?

[Mistress]

1) Oh, I forgot about the Wizard...Nessa, I don't see much of her besides the whiny possessive sister character, so I would appreciate some clarification on that point.

2) Of course not. I just found (inintially) that it was a tad disturbing, the Philososphy club scene, at least,. But I also see the fascination with the sex...it's a different side to the WWOTW, and very human too. It was just my first time reading a rather descriptive piece on an interspecies sex club orgy, otherwise the rest of the sex wasn't too disturbing, I was just surprised at how plentiful it was...normally the stuff I read doesn't more than one or two sex scenes (I like a good forensic murder mystery and the occasional fantasy novel, hense Wicked).

[mastachen]

Nessa's personality in the first act and in the second act are totally different. With more material, I'd really like to see how that transformation happens and when it began.

[Mistress]

[Felix Felicis]

Do you want some advice if you want to like Wicked?
Don't try?
I went through the same thing with Spring Awakening - it was the big show, Tony winner etc. I made myself sit down and listen and really, really try to like it. But it just wasn't my thing.

Although if you want to know why I find Wicked likeable:
The kid in me likes the backstory to the Tin Woodsman/Scarecrow etc.
I think the journey of Elphaba and Glinda's friendship is a very moving one to watch, and I can relate it to friendships of my own.

As for the music - I like the accessibility of the score. A lot of it's nice, simple tunes, but there is a complexity there if you want to look for it.
The orchestrations, for instance, are simply fantastic.

[ConverseSneaker]

I love Nessarose in the book and the musical, btw.


Anyways....what really got me into Wicked was the book. Absolutely loved it.

Yeah the songs are all pop(NOT what I would have imagined for Wicked), although Defy Gravity is a catchy phrase. And G(a)linda and Fiyero are terrible characters. If they were written better and that riduclous song Popular was taken out, I think the show would be much better.


What I would do if I could rewrite the show:
Make really good music for it. None of this pop stuff.
Make Nessarose a MUCH bigger character.
Shrink Glinda and Fiyero's parts(not Fiyero so much as Glinda though.)
Rewrite Glinda and Fiyero's characters
Less importance on the special effects.

[Little_Nell]

To be honest, I wouldn't look for a reason to like it. If you don't, you don't. Simple as. Listen to the cast recording a couple of times and if it doesn't stick with you it's obviously not your thing - at least then you've given it a go.

You really don't want to try and like it just because everyone else does - if we all liked the same things, life would be incredibly boring. For instance, I adore CATS and always have done but everyone else I know hates it with a passion. What does it matter though?

I was determined not to like it but my friend did me a copy to listen to and we were doing it for a term at my musical theatre class and I just got attached to it. I hated the fact that everyone was raving about it but despite that I still ended up liking it. I like the character of Elphaba, I like the music and I like the memories I have of performing bits of it with my friends whilst wearing too much green makeup.

[ChorusKidx3]

A lot of people that I know are in love with the older musicals like Oklahoma!, Showboat and Sound of Music, which I have nothing against and they say that the newer musicals like Wicked and Phantom are a disgrace to Broadway. I mean a lot of people have read the book and if you have, you know what I am talking about. I respect others opinions but not when its something that I love.

[mastachen]

[ChorusKidx3]

[mastachen]

It is very subjective, but why should I like a musical that I think is really bad? I can watch a musical that I love upwards of 50 times if I had the money, but I wouldn't go watch Mamma Mia again if you paid me. I have better things to do with my time then fawn over musicals that I think were poorly written (one or two exceptions: my 'guilty pleasures')

Do you like all musicals yourself? Or do you only have a select few that you can enjoy, while others cause you to want to bang your head against the wall?

[ChorusKidx3]

[mastachen]

I like your perspective. lol

Welcome to the forum

[ChorusKidx3]

[Matthew]

[ChorusKidx3]

[MiLeZ]

Maybe I completely missed this as I skimmed over the replies, but have you SEEN it yet?

My mom really wanted to see the show and I was completely indifferent to it, partly because it was the "it" show. I agreed to go see it with her in Cincinnati and by The Wizard and I, I was sold - I loved it.

Listening to the cast recording prior to seeing the show didn't do anything for me. Therefore, I disagree with the "listen to the cast recording a few times and if you don't like it...it's not your thing."

If you can, GO SEE IT (if you haven't)! This may change a lot for it.

I WAS in the same boat you are now...

[ChorusKidx3]

[musicaltheatrefan]

Having just celebrated the 4th Anniversary of its Broadway opening, WICKED’s four North American and three international companies have cumulatively grossed over $800 million and have been seen by over 10 million people worldwide.

The New York Times called WICKED "Broadway's biggest blockbuster" and just this year, the Times referred to WICKED as "one of the most successful shows in Broadway history."

Over 3 million people have seen WICKED on Broadway since it began performances in the fall of 2003.

WICKED has grossed a combined total of over $700 million for its four North American companies. The Broadway production alone has grossed over $300 million.

The Broadway production of WICKED has broken the house record at the Gershwin Theatre eighteen (1 times during the course of its run. It regularly grosses in excess of $1.4 million each week.

For the week ending December 31, 2006, the Broadway production of WICKED grossed over $1.8 million, the highest one-week box office take in Broadway history.

Current advance sales for the Broadway production of WICKED are approximately $37 million as the show enters its fifth year on Broadway. It is extremely rare for a show to maintain (and continue to build) that level of advance sales so long after its initial debut.

In its coverage of the national touring production, Peter Marks, of The Washington Post, called WICKED "a breathtaking success story of a magnitude that North America has not witnessed since the peak years of THE PHANTOM OF THE OPERA."

On national tour (which has been traveling across North America for 145 weeks), over 3 million people have seen WICKED.

The four current North American companies of WICKED cumulatively gross in excess of $5.5 million per week.

Since it began in March, 2005, the national tour of WICKED has broken the house record in every single city in which it’s played, including Toronto, San Francisco, Denver, Dallas, Houston, St. Louis, Hartford, Washington D.C., Tampa, Ft. Lauderdale, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Philadelphia, Boston, Atlanta, Detroit, Cleveland, San Diego, Costa Mesa, Phoenix/Tempe, Portland, Seattle, Providence, Baltimore, Miami, East Lansing, Oklahoma City, and Columbus.

In St. Louis, the national tour of WICKED grossed $2.045 million in a single week (week ending December 4, 2006), the highest weekly gross in North American touring history.

Chris Jones, of the Chicago Tribune, has called WICKED "the most popular piece of Chicago theatre in a generation."

In Chicago (where the open-ended sit-down production celebrated its 1,000th performance on November 14, 2007 at the Ford Center for Performing Arts, Oriental Theatre), over 2 million people have seen WICKED. The production grossed $1,376,468 for the week ending December 31, 2006, making it Chicago’s highest-grossing week ever.

In his review of the Los Angeles production, Charles McNulty, of the Los Angeles Times, stated that "WICKED is a phenomenon that keeps growing."

WICKED opened its fourth North American production, with a sit-down company at the Pantages Theatre in Los Angeles, on February 21, 2007. For the week ending Sunday, March 4, WICKED broke the house record at the Pantages Theatre – with a box office gross of $1,768,110 – and became the highest grossing attraction in Los Angeles theatre history.

WICKED has won fifteen major awards, including the Grammy Award, three Tony Awards and six Drama Desk Awards including Best Musical.

In November 2006, the Grammy Award winning (Best Musical Show Album) original cast recording of WICKED was certified “Platinum” by the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), for sales of more than 1 million copies in print.

The novel "Wicked" by Gregory Maguire, published in 1995, has sold over 3 million copies, with 2.5 million of those sold since 2003 when the musical opened. Buoyed by the musical’s success, the novel still appears on bestseller lists 12 years after its initial publication.

THE GRIMMERIE, WICKED’s official companion book about the making of the musical, has sold nearly 150,000 copies, making it the best-selling book of its kind in theatre history.

Merchandise sales for WICKED (t-shirts, caps, jewelry, stuffed toys, etc.) have exceeded $60 million, making it the fastest selling show-related merchandise in history.

In his review of the London production, Tim Walker, of the Sunday Telegraph (London), called WICKED “blockbuster entertainment – it is magnificent to see a musical that manages to be both populist and intelligent at the same time.”

WICKED opened in London’s West End on September 27, 2006 at the Apollo Victoria Theatre. It created London theatre history by selling over £100,000 worth of tickets in its first half-hour of sales. It has since gone on to set the all-time record for highest weekly gross in West End history with the week ending December 31, 2006, taking in £873,020/$1,694,000 (U.S).

Since opening, the London production of WICKED has consistently been one of the two highest grossing shows in the West End and has often been the top grossing show.

In his review of the Japanese language production, Hitomi Hagio, of The Tokyo, called WICKED "a spectacular entertainment with deep emotions and a serious message."

A Japanese language production of WICKED opened in Tokyo on June 17, 2007 at the Dentsu Shiki Theatre and has been playing to consistent capacity crowds ever since.

In his review of the German language production, Tim Schleider, of Stuttgarter Zeitung, proclaimed, "there is no doubt, Wicked is the most entertaining, the liveliest, the most colorful and, above all, the smartest production that we have seen at the Stuttgart Musical Centre."

A German language production of WICKED opened in Stuttgart on November 15, 2007 at the Stuttgart Musical Centre and has been playing to consistent capacity crowds ever since.

The Australian production of WICKED will open in Melbourne on July 12, 2008.

A Dutch-language production of WICKED will open in 2009.

There, you have it!

[mastachen]

The second and third Pirates of the Caribbean broke box office records as did the Harry Potter movies and Shrek movies.

Nobody would mistake them for good movies though.



How much one earns at box offices is not a measure of how good a show is.

[ChorusKidx3]

They're making Shrek the Musical By the way.

[wicked_boy]

musicaltheatrefan, that was really interesting to read.

Where did you find all that information from?

[sweeney_pod]

musicaltheatrefan, they have a debate about what you just posted over in the Social forum (it's titled Sondheim though.)

Wicked falls flat when I listen to it. But I don't hate on people who absolutely love it either.

[ChorusKidx3]

Thanks MTF. I liked that a lot. =]

[musicaltheatrefan]

www.wickedthemusical.com.au go to about wicked and then wicked history. By the way, did you know that in Australia, "Wicked" just sold A$2.3 million in advanced ticket sales. That beat Phantom's record in Australia by 15 percent!

[mastachen]

[musicaltheatrefan]

In movies, that may be the case, but theatregoers are a bit more picky and when a show gets A$2.3 million in 3 hours, then you know it's good. Do you honestly think that if "Wicked' was a poorly written show, it would have productions in 4 continents. Do you think it would have had a combined total of $700 million for all of the North American companies, with $300 million of that being from Broadway. Do you think 3 million people would flock to New York to see a poorly written show? Do you think a poorly written show would play 5 years on Broadway, with no signs of a closing within the next 15 years. "Wicked" might not be your cup of tea, but a lot of people love it and you shouldn't always bring them down.

[shakalakababy]

it's another pounce

[mastachen]

I'm not bringing them down. I'm just saying, using monetary statistics to say Wicked is a good show is bullshit. If you want to talk about the qualities of a show, talk about score, lyrics, characterization, plot, etc. I'm sure the OP doesn't care about all the money the show's making either, because when he/she goes to watch it, she's not gonna focus on how much the show is making. She's going to focus on the characters and the score and whatnot.

And theatregoers are not more picky than moviegoers. It sounds like you consider yourself to be intellectually and culturally superior than non-theatergoers. lol

[musicaltheatrefan]

The average American goes to the cinema a lot more than the theatre. The average American doesn't even see 2 musicals a year. Okay, so we are a bit more picky then them. And by the way, I was using the monetary statistics to prove that Wicked is a great show, not as the sole reason to see it. Other people covered that, I was just enforcing that

[mastachen]

You missed my point by 10.4839 miles.


Which, by the way, is the exact distance between where I'm currently living and the Pantages Theater, where Wicked is currently playing.

[Kragey]

[wicked_boy]

I found the philosophy part disgusting.

[mastachen]

[wicked_boy]

[ChorusKidx3]

[lckysvn777]

[Lepitot]

[Kragey]

[Lepitot]

true, but even so...the cast doesn't change every week.

If everyone thought Wicked was a terrible show, it would STOP breaking records. People wouldn't go see a terrible show to see a new cast. They go see it because they like it.

Sure, it isn't as fancy as some other shoes. It's not as deep. It's fluff. It's made to entertain a wide audience. And, obviously that wide audience likes it, or else the show wouldn't continue to make money. You don't have to like it. Theatre-knowledgable people do not have to enjoy Wicked. They can tear it apart. They can say it's not as good musically as Sondheim. They can say the book is flat. Blah blah blah.

But, the fact is that the vast majority doesn't care, or notice. They think the music is wonderful, they like the plot. They love the story. It's a twist on The Wizard of Oz. It's a show you can take the kids to. It's a show the entire family can enjoy. They enjoy it for what it is.

I think people should stop expecting the show to be more than it is and just be thankful that it's there and that it's bringing people into theatre.

[wicked_boy]

Because my life is sad, I like to check the Broadway grosses every week.

I've been doing this since October 07.

Every time (except once or twice) Wicked has been the highest.

I feel sorry for the shows at the bottom though.

[mastachen]

Jon, your first post is full of contradictions. Notice how I never said on this thread that Wicked is a bad show? I'm just saying that posting box office numbers does not answer the OP's question of why people like this show.


And Nae is right. If it wasn't for new cast members and understudies, people would be bored of Wicked really quickly. Who the hell watches Wicked once a week?

And to musicaltheatrefan (I haven't forgotten about you!) - it's true that the average American watches more movies than musicals, but how it disproves my point that bad movies earn money too is beyond me. Wicked is a tourist attraction, plain and simple. Someone on the Australian Witches thread said, if a city doesn't think Wicked is monetarily viable, then they're not gonna put it on. The producers of Wicked aren't even treating it like a piece of art - more of a money machine.

[musical_maven]

[BroadwayObssessed]

[Catherine]

^ I was totally going to join that in my fangirl stage! It wouldn't let me though. I'm so glad it didn't.

[wicked_boy]